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course, be his duty to consider that records of the Horse Guards furnished would be the future formation of these no account of such an occurrence, and he Boards when proposing legislation no could learn nothing of it from the Judge the subject.

Advocate General, with whom he had

been in communication upon the subject. METROPOLIS-QUEEN ANNE'S STATUE | The alleged occurrence was an impos-ST. PAUL'S CHURCHYARD. sible one, because the sentence of a court

martial was never given in Court, and MR. GORST asked the First Commis- it had been confirmed by the Queen

no one knew anything of it until after sioner of Works, Whether his attention and remitted to the Judge Advocate has been directed to the dilapidated con- General. dition of the statue of Queen Anne opposite St. Paul's Cathedral; and, who

CRIMINAL LAW-CASE OF SAMUEL is responsible for keeping that statue

DAWSON.-QUESTION. in a proper state of repair ?

LORD HENRY LENNOX: Sir, my MR. MACDONALD asked the Presi. attention and that of my Predecessor has dent of the Local Government Board, If been called to the dilapidated condition his attention has been directed to the of Queen Anne's statue, which is placed case of Samuel Dawson, an agricultural opposite the Western façade of St. Paul's labourer, who was sent to Bedford Gaol Cathedral. It has been computed that on the 11th of June for two months, from the sum necessary for its complete resto- the Tharm Brook Petty Sessions, county ration would amount to about £500 or of Bedford, because he was unable to £600, besides a small sum for its annual pay the sum of one pound sixteen shillings maintenance. I may inform my hon. that he had been ordered to pay, at the Friend that the early history of this rate of one shilling per week, for mainstatue appears to be enveloped in some tenance or support of his parents; whemystery. No one knows who placed ther he is aware that Dawson's goods Her Majesty in her present posi- had been previously distrained for debt, tion. No one appears to know whether and that they were of too little value to Her Majesty has ever been repaired since meet the liability; whether Dawson is in she was placed there; and, worse than the gaoi compelled to pick oakum as if all, no one has yet been found with suffi- sentenced to hard labour; whether, concient loyalty to claim the ownership of sidering that Dawson was unable to pay, Her Majesty. I may add that as the that his being sent to prison was not statue is not within the area of the Me- illegal ; and, whether he will place upon tropolitan Police District, I fear I have the Table of the House the names of the no statutory power to take Her Majesty committing magistrates ? under my charge.

MR. SCLATER - BOOTH, in reply, said, he had been in communication with

his right hon. Friend the Secretary of CRIMINAL LAW—SENTENCE ON JOHN State with reference to the matter. He O'BRIEN.-QUESTION.

had to inform the hon. Member that it MR. PARNELL asked the Secretary was within the power of the Guardians of State for the Home Department, to institute such proceedings, although Whether he will direct an inquiry to be he did not intend to offer any opinion as made into the circumstances connected to the way in which they had dealt with with the sentencing of the military pri- the present case. When it was proposed soner John O'Brien, independently of to distrain on the goods of the person in the reference to the record of the mili- question it was found that they had tary proceedings, with the view of re- already been disposed of by a bill of sale. commending the extension of the Royal With reference to the other portions of clemency to him, in case it should be the Question, it would, of course, be the found that his sentence had been ex. duty of the governor of the gaol to tended from ten years to life in conse- put him to the employment which the quence of his exclamation when leaving class of prisoners to which he belonged the dock ?

generally performed. He could not MR. ASSHETON CROSS, in reply, place the names of the magistrates on said, he had formerly stated that the the Table.

Sir Michael Hicks-Beach

upon it.


ARMY-ADJUTANTS OF MILITIA. MR. A. PEEL asked the President of

QUESTION. the Local Government Board, If he has

COLONEL NAGHTEN ked the Sereceived any explanation from Mr. Andrew Doyle in reply to the Report cretary of State for War, If he will

recommend that those Adjutants of of the Committee on Immigration and Colonization to the Dominion of Canada; ment of those officers has been invested

Militia who retired since the appointand, if he has received such explanation, in the Crown, shall receive the benefit whether he has any objection to place it of the increased retiring allowance upon the Table of the House ? MR. SCLATER - BOOTH, in reply,

granted by the new warrant ?

MR. GATHORNE HARDY: Sir, the said, he had received the explanation Patent of the 26th of March last was referred to. He had also received further information on the subject from not intended to be retrospective, and I

am afraid I cannot make it so. the Colonial Office, and he hoped to lay the Papers on the Table before the end of the Session.




cretary of State for War, Whether, BONDED WAREHOUSES. - QUESTION. having regard to the fact that the Staff

LORD FREDERICK CAVENDISH of the 40th Depôt Brigade is now at asked the Secretary to the Treasury, Winchester, and that the Depôt of the Whether the inquiries instituted by the Regiments belonging to that Brigade is late Government into the regulations of now, and for some time past has been, the Customs and Inland Revenue De- at Port Elson, Gosport, it is the intenpartments under which goods liable to tion of the Government to build Barracks duty are warehoused have yet been con- at Winchester, or to inake such arrangecluded; and, whether it is the intention ments there as may enable the Staff of the present Board of Treasury to and Depôt of the said Regiments to be take steps to secure uniformity in the quartered together? practice of the two departments, and to

MR. GATHORNE HARDY: Yes, Sir, place all bonding warehouses in any it is intended to make some additional district under one department, with the buildings at Winchester Barracks for view of affording increased facilities to the purpose the hon. Member alludes to. trade, and of diminishing the charge on the Exchequer? Mr. W. H. SMITH: The inquiries,


-LEGISLATION.-QUESTION. Sir, instituted by the late Government into the bonding systems of the Customs COLONEL EGERTON LEIGH asked and Inland Revenue Departments have the First Lord of the Treasury, Whebeen continued under the present Go-ther a Bill for the better protection of vernment, but the Report of the Com- women and children from gross and mittee has not yet been received, owing violent assaults and illtreatment will be partly to the length to which their introduced as one of the earliest meainquiries have extended, and partly to sures of the next Session ? the dangerous illness of one of the MR. DISRAELI : Sir, the subject in Members, which necessitated a suspen- which my hon. and gallant Friend takes sion of their labours for some months. so much interest—which is shared in, I I understand, however, that they expect may say, by the majority of the House to be able to send it in in the course of “will not be lost sight of by the Goa week or so, and as soon as it is re- vernment; but on the whole, as a geneceived it will be duly considered by the ral principle, I do not think it is conTreasury and the Boards of Customs venient to pledge the Government as and Inland Revenue ; but until we have to the introduction of any particular had it before us, it is impossible to measure.



documents should be made forthcoming, THE CASE OF CHRISTIE v. GELSON.

if necessary, at the trial before the Irish Court. The Crown agent, under the

instructions of the Crown counsel, deDR. CAMERON asked the Lord Ad- clined to comply with the application, vocate, Whether it is true that in the the ground of the declinature being that action for malicious prosecution, brought it would entirely destroy the value of by Mr. James Christie, of Glasgow, the office of public prosecutor if, whenagainst Mr. Gelson, of Belfast

, in the ever an accused person was acquitted, Irish Court of Queen's Bench, and which he could call upon the Crown authorities resulted in a verdict in Mr. Christie's in criminal prosecutions to produce the favour, access to the criminal informa confidential documents in their possestion on which the original prosecution sion, in order to found an action of had been founded was refused to Mr. damages against the accuser. The right Christie by the Crown Office in Edin- of the public prosecutor to withhold such burgh, on the plea that such refusal was documents has been uniformly recogfor the ends of public justice, while a nized by the Courts in Scotland; but it certified copy of it and other documents is proper I should state that in exerwas given to Mr. Gelson ; and, if so, on cising it those representing the Crown what grounds such distinction was made; would feel bound to consider whether and, whether the Procurator Fiscal, who the charge made against an accused conducted the original prosecution, and person had been made recklessly or mawho disregarded a subpæna from the liciously; and if satisfied that it had Irish Court of Queen's Bench to attend been so made, they would not hesitate and produce documents in the action of to waive the right. In the present case, “ Christie v. Gelson,” did so on his own which was very carefully considered, responsibility or with the sanction of the there was no reason for holding that the Crown Office in Edinburgh ?

charge had been made maliciously. I THE LORD ADVOCATE: Sir, in regret to say that since the Question of order to give a satisfactory Answer to the hon. Gentleman was put on the the Question of the hon. Gentleman, it Paper, the Crown authorities have will be necessary for me, with the in- learned for the first time that when the dulgence of the House, to make a some action of damages was threatened, the what fuller reference to the case out of Procurator Fiscal of Glasgow, without which the Question has arisen than is consultation or authority, gave to the made in the Question itself. In October agents of Messrs. Gelson a copy of the last Messrs. Gelson, tobacco manufac- information and of the warrants proturers, Belfast, lodged information with ceeding upon it. I can only explain the the Procurator Fiscal, Glasgow, charging action of the very careful and experitheir agent, Mr. James Christie, of 130 enced gentleman who committed the Hope Street, Glasgow, with breach of mistake, by supposing that he did not trust and embezzlement. The Procu- think he was acting against the Crown rator Fiscal immediately investigated the Office regulation, by giving Messrs.Gelson charge, and in the course of doing so, a copy of the information which they communicated with the police of Liver- had themselves lodged with him. It pool, whither Christie had gone. The was a mistake, however, and if the result was that Christie was appre- Crown authorities had known that copies hended, and committed for trial. The of any documents had been given to the precognitions having been considered by one party, they would at once have afCrown counsel, Christie was indicted for forded similar information to the other. the Christmas circuit at Glasgow; but In regard to the non-attendance of the the jury, by a majority, found him not Procurator Fiscal on the subpoena from guilty. He then raised before the Court the Irish Court, I have to state that that of Queen's Bench, Ireland, an action for gentleman has explained to the Crown malicious prosecution, false arrestment, agent that from the state of his health and slander. Christie's agent applied he was unable to go to Dublin. He was in April last to the Crown agent in Scot- informed by the Crown agent that he land for a copy of the information which must act in regard to this matter upon had been lodged with the Procurator his own responsibility. He accordingly Fiscal, and asked that the principal forwarded a medical certificate as to the

state of his health to Mr. Kavanagh, absolutely decided upon, but that notice the attorney for Christie in Dublin, who of the result would be given prior to the acknowledged the receipt of it before 1st of October of this year. the trial took place. Mr. Kavanagh then intimated his intention of serving CRIMINAL LAW-FATAL OCCURRENCE me with a subpoena, but he did not NEAR GALASHIELS-PROSECUTION carry out his intention, and I observe he OF A CONSTABLE.-QUESTION. obtained a verdict without my assistance

MR. TREVELYAN asked the Secreor the aid of the documents for which he had called. I should only further whether the Government is prepared

tary of State for the Home Department, add that the subpoena required the Pro- to prosecute the constable Macconachie, curator Fiscal to attend before the Chief who is under suspicion of having killed Justice of the Queen's Bench in Dublin

a man who refused to give up a gun and on the 14th day of June, but it was not bag which he was carrying on a high served upon him until the 17th of that month. Possibly this may arise from true, as alleged, that the constable in

road near Galashiels; and, whether it is peculiarities of Irish procedure, with question was still at large some days which I am unacquainted.

after the fatal occurrence ?


said, that the circumstances of the case LETTER CARRIERS---THE CASE OF

referred to had been inquired into by PATRICK CULLEN.-QUESTION.

the Procurator Fiscal of Roxburgshire, MR. REDMOND asked the Post- the county in which it occurred, and he master General, If his attention has had reported to the Town Council of been directed to the observations of Mr. Edinburgh. The Town Council had Baron Dowse, at the recent Wexford ordered a most searching investigation Assizes, in sentencing a letter carrier, into the case with the view to its being named Patrick Cullen, to twelve months' prosecuted in the most thorough manner. imprisonment for stealing a letter con. It was true that the police constable retaining a two shilling piece; and if he ferred to had not been in custody, but could hold out any hope that the present he understood from the Lord Advocate pay of country letter carriers will be that he would at once be placed in raised ?

charge of the sheriff. LORD JOHN MANNERS, in reply, said, he had not had an opportunity of MONASTIC AND CONVENTUAL INSTIreading the remarks of the Judge TUTIONS_RETURNS.-QUESTION. alluded to, but he understood that the

MR CAWLEY (for Mr. Holt) asked subject was receiving attention in the proper quarter. The salaries of these the Under Secretary of State for the letter carriers were being continually

Home Department, Whether he is in revised, and if in this particular case, possession of any information sufficient

I the in the after inquiry, it was found that the pay Motion for a Return of the number of was insufficient, it would be increased.

deaths in Monastic and Conventual In

stitutions in Great Britain which has reARMY-ADJUTANTS OF MILITIA.

cently been on the Paper ? QUESTION.

SIR HENRY SELWIN-IBBETSON, COLONEL ALEXANDER asked the in reply, said, he was not in a position Secretary of State for War, Whether to give sufficient information, or to the Adjutants of Militia who decline to furnish a Return upon the subject reavail themselves of the new retirement ferred to by the hon. Member. No scheme, and who are required to per- specific Report as to the deaths in quesform the same military duty as other tion was to be found in the Registrar officers belonging to the Brigade Depôt, General's Office, and, although the Census will be allowed to retain their relative Paper mentioned the principal public rank in the Army ?

institutions, it was impossible to deMR. GATHORNE HARDY, in reply, termine which of them were those resaid, that the position of Adjutants of ferred to, or to say whether St. ElizaMilitia under the circumstances to which beth's Home, St. James's Home, or St. the Question referred had not yet been Joseph's Home were Monastic or Conventual Protestant or Roman Catholic MR. E. J. REED in rising to move, Institutions.

“That the overloading of merchant ships can

not be effectually restrained unless owners and ARMY-THE AUTUMN MANEUVRES. captains are prohibited from loading their ships QUESTION.

beyond a load-line limit of safety which has

either been sanctioned by the Government or MR. HAYTER asked the Secretary of submitted to the Government for record.” State for War, Whether he will consider the propriety of providing in the next said, his object in proposing that ResoluEstimate for the Autumn Manæuvres,

tion was to facilitate, and not to delay, the

The right hon. for the expense of providing waterproof progress of the Bill. sheeting for the horses of non-com- Gentleman at the head of the Governmissioned officers and troopers of the ment had informed them that public excavalry similar to that now in general citement had assisted in the production use by the officers for their own chargers, inclined to believe that it was the result

of this measure; but he (Mr. Reed) was and in lieu of the heavy rugs issued in the late severe weather; and, whether of the excitement, for he could not any portion of the price of the spirits imagine a British Government in the issued to the troops at the Camp on the present day withdrawing a Bill on such Coldingley Heath will be charged to the a question as that; while they secretly non-commissioned officers and men ?

resolved to produce an arbitrary and abMR. GATHORNE HARDY, in reply,

solute measure on the same subject at said, that the mode of protecting horses the first opportunity. He had no doubt, was one upon which all military autho- however, that the Bill was brought forrities were not agreed, some preferring ward as a sincere attempt on the part of one way, some another; but some steps the Government to meet a great public would be taken in the matter. With necessity, although it had the disadvanregard to the second part of the Question, tage of investing the Executive Governthe charges referred to had been made, ment with great arbitrary power without but owing to the exceptional circum- defining in any degree the manner in

When it stances of the case he had given direc- which it should be exercised. tions that they should be remitted.

came under his observation, he felt that

it was very desirable it should make proCRIMINAL LAW_THE CONVICT

vision for the regulation of deck cargoes MONSEN.-OBSERVATION.

and cargoes of grain, for the restriction

of ships within a reasonable draught of MR. M CARTHY DOWNING said, water, when laden, and for a compulsory it was unnecessary to ask the right hon.

survey, Gentleman the Secretary of State for of Amendments on that subject. The

and he accordingly gave Notice the Home Department the Question as Government had met the proposal not to which he had given him private very handsomely or broadly, but very Notice in reference to the case of the quickly, with the intimation that they convict Monsen, to which attention had would not be unwilling to entertain in been called in The Times of that morning Committee Amendments to regulate deck by a letter from the foreman of the jury cargoes and grain stowage, and that anwho tried him. The right hon. Gentle- nouncement by the Government had been man had in that case, as in all others favourably received by the Opposition. which had been brought under his It could not, however, be denied that notice in that House, exercised his judg, one of the great causes of the loss of life ment with that care, consideration, and at sea was the reckless overloading of mercy which had won for him the high ships, especially in the winter months, character he enjoyed as Home Secretary. and, therefore, he, and those who were

interested in the subject, had to consider UNSEAWORTHY SHIPS BILL.

whether they were not bound to press (Sir Charles Adderley, Mr. Disraeli, Mr. Chan


the Government the necessity for cellor of the Excheqrter.)

the introduction into their Bill of some (BILL 274.] COMMITTEE.

provision which would have the effect of Order for Committee read.

preventing overloading. Those who Motion made, and Question proposed, sympathized with the hon. Member for " That Mr. Speaker do now leave the Derby (Mr. Plimsoll) would also have Chair.”—(Sir Charles Adderley.) been glad if the Government had intro

Sir IIenry Selwin-Ibbetson

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