I don't think it wise to enter into a discussion of the question of electric transmission, or having an individual motor placed on any line of shafting.

In this drawing the rope drive shown was arranged for a possible extension of the mill. The drive shown to the right is the one first used. The belt tower, in the event of an extension of the mill, is large enough, and space in the engine room is provided for another tandem compound engine.

If there are any questions which I can answer, I should be very glad to do so.

The PRESIDENT.

You have heard the remarks of Mr. GREENE. You will now have an opportunity to ask him any questions, or discuss the subject in any way you choose.

Mr. BOURNE. I would like to ask what system of rope driving he finds to be the best.

Mr. GREENE. In any case where the power is considerable, anything above a hundred horse-power, I have found the English system, the individual ropes, altogether better.

The PRESIDENT. I have no doubt that some of the members present have had something to do with the rope-driving system, and we should be pleased to hear from them.

Mr. RUSSELL. What is the life of a rope in comparison with the life of a belt, in a drive of that style?

Mr. GREENE. I don't know that anybody is able to answer that question definitely. Ropes have not been used in this country long enough, and there are no such conditions as would warrant an accurate answer. If I were to give an opinion, I should say that the life of a manila rope, under good conditions, would range from five to seven years. A good belt, if there is put on the amount of leather there ought to be, should have a life of at least twenty years.

The PRESIDENT. We have had them run thirty-nine years or more, and they are in good condition now. I would like to inquire of Mr. LEIGH if he is conversant with the rope drive.

Mr. LEIGH. In England many In England many have gone into rope driving, and it is very popular; but personally I fail to see where the advantage is, except in the first cost. Every few years one or two ropes have to be replaced; whereas a belt, if properly applied, will last for thirty or forty years. I think there is more loss of power on the rope than on the belt system.

Mr. KNIGHT. What is the relative economy, as far as power is concerned, between the belt and rope systems?

Mr. GREENE. As far as I know, there are no tests which will settle conclusively that question. I can conceive of a rope drive being run where the showing as regards power might be erroneous; but it makes all the difference in the world what the design of the groove is, and the relation of the rope to the groove. I did not intend to spring the question of rope driving on this body, and I want to be explicit on that point. I confined myself to the question I was asked to discuss, and I simply used that drawing in which ropes were used to illustrate my remarks. I am not here to apologise for the rope system. I might say that I have no reason to change the opinion I formed two or three years ago, that, for a large amount of power, anything over five or six hundred horse-power, or where the power is concentrated and needs to be taken off to various head shafts in the mill, I know of no way the problem can be solved so satisfactorily as by the rope drive. Mr. HERVEY KENT. In regard to rope driving, we have been taking some two hundred horse-power from one wheel with five ropes, between three or four years, and so far it has given us no trouble. We have had nothing to do since we put them on. It is necessary to be a little careful in starting up; we start that wheel a little before the others, so as not to throw the leading on the other side, and unless you have plenty of room you may have trouble in that direction. Then again, I think it cost eighty-one dollars for the ropes, while the cost of a belt would be three or four times that. So, on the score of first cost, the ropes are much cheaper.

Mr. JOHNSTON. How much less do the pulleys cost?

Mr. HERVEY KENT. Very much less; they are much lighter.

Mr. JOHNSTON. It depends on what rope you use.

Mr. HERVEY KENT. We use manila rope. We use manila rope. Of course the grooves have something to do with it. I do not see why they may not go another year as well as they do now.

Mr. GREENE. With reference to the matter of trouble and care, in order that my position may not be misunderstood, I will mention one or two instances that came within my observation: Two years ago last June a mill requiring one thousand or twelve hundred horse-power was started with rope transmission, which I designed; there were twenty-seven one and three-quarter inch ropes. In May this year the ropes had been run twenty-three months. Three had never been touched; the others had been taken up once. There was considerable slack in those three ropes, and it was expected that in two or three months they would have to be taken up. I have not heard of a belt that has been on that time that would not have to be taken up. But for the ropes to do good service they must have room; you cannot draw them tightly and keep taking them up without their giving out. Unless the conditions are all right for good running, I would advise letting the rope drive alone and take the belt drive.

Mr. BIRKENHEAD. My experience of transmitting power by means of a round band or rope is, that it has never been looked upon in as favorable a light as it otherwise would have been, for this reason; you will find in very many cases where the attempt is made to transmit power from one part of a machine to another with a round belt, or band, the maker of the machine put a groove in his pulleys unsuited for frictional contact. Where positive drive is necessary, you will often find the groove that is to receive the band on an angle of ninety degrees, or square; now there is no more frictional contact in this case than there would be if the band lay on a flat surface,

like the flat face of a pulley. What is needed is an angle of from forty to forty-five degrees; you then have a positive drive groove. It has long been my opinion that the expensive and cumbersome belt will have to take a back seat.

The PRESIDENT. We will now take up the next topic, “Can the dust room of the picker be done away with?" by Mr. JOHN W. WELLS* of Woodbury, N. J.

Mr. WELLS. In many picker plants the dust room would be available for holding machinery, provided by some means the dust could be taken care of. The value of such space is a good measure of the outlay which can be afforded to replace the dust room.

In handling sawdust and some fibrous substances, and in taking shavings away from planers, there is provided a dust separator. The Arlington & Curtis Company, East Saginaw, Mich., build them, and hold the patents on them. To simply describe it, it is a truncated cone of proper proportions, into which fans can discharge. Any fan discharging into the atmosphere distributes its dust and fibre in all directions. The dust room simply limits the area in which that dust is spread, and the chimney takes away the air and some of the dust. A separator limits still further the dust and fibre carried out by the fan. It also changes the directions of the air currents from straight lines to circular.

It was originally called the cyclone dust separator, as it creates a mimic cyclone within its walls. A centrifugal motion is imparted to the dust, which is blown from the dust pipe as soon as it arrives in the separator. The lint and heavy dust is carried round on the walls of the separator, and gradually falls down to the apex of the cone, and as soon as it drops out of the current of air it will drop into a bag or a proper receptacle.

*The Secretary minutes here, with great regret, the sudden death of Mr. WELLS, by accident, while in the discharge of his duties, which occurred Nov. 9, 1892. His remarks therefore appear without revision.

The simplest arrangement would be to place the pipe on the wall, and put on the separator as near as you can; but in twostory or higher buildings it will be necessary to carry the discharge pipe above the roof, to prevent covering the buildings with dust. Another and simpler way is to carry the separator itself on top of the roof. The separator can be adjusted so as to deposit its products in any convenient place, or carried to any part of the building where the waste cleaning is to be done. If that is not done, it should be carried to the top of the roof. The economy in its use is in the economy of space, and in saving as much of the dust as possible before it reaches the dust room. If it goes into this room the product is of little or no use, as it is mixed with other dust; whereas, from a separator where there were seven fans, I have collected in one day as much as four pounds of lint which required little or no cleaning, most of the heavy dust having gone up the chimney of the separator. There might be some other cleaning done after the matter leaves the separator, by passing over some trunk arrangement; but probably it would be better to take all to waste-cleaning machines.

I don't think that anybody who has a first-class dust room, with plenty of space for everything, will bother about separators unless the room is valuable. I can only speak of the small plant which I have been running for some two or three months without a dust room, and I think the results have been better than with a dust room. At our other mill our dust room is of ample size. It is no gain to use a separator, unless one prefers it, in such a case, and prefers to pay for it.

As to the price, if you put only one separator to each machine the price will be quite large, say $125 or $140 for a two-beater picker; but as the size of the separator increases the price is proportionately lessened; for six or eight fans I think $250 would cover the expense of the separator.

This method has been used by woollen mills to a considerable extent. In John Bromley's mill a fan takes dust from several pickers into one separator. This dust separator took the place